Protein Sparing Modified Fast
Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 02:03 PM


Expert Low-Carber


Got a question. Anyone ever done a protein sparing modified fast to lose weight? If so, what happened? Did you feel okay? Did you lose?

I've been reading about this over at Lyle McDonald's site, and am curious to find some real life experiences with this method. I'd ask over there, but that forum is not as friendly as ours.. they are kinda grumpy over there.

Ellen
http://www.healthy-eating-politics.com
http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 02:05 PM


Expert Low-Carber


Never heard of it. Tell me more, Ellen.



RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 02:05 PM


Administrator


I haven't Ellen!

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RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 02:24 PM


Expert Low-Carber



In the past, the PSMF was based on protein shakes from companies like medifast, and optifast, which were dangerous because the protein in the shakes was just collagen which can't be used by the body very well. Lyle McDonald has a different take. He recommends a whole foods protein fast for rapid weight loss.

Basically what he describes is a low calorie diet (based on your particular body needs) in which you eat mostly lean protein foods like chicken and fish, a tiny bit of carb and fat, and you take lots of fish oil for essential fatty acids and vitamins and minerals. You do this for as long as can stand it, or until you lose the weight you want to lose. He recommends that you "break" the diet every 4-6 weeks and replenish your glycogen stores, and he also allows for a few "free meals" each week as a psychological steam valve, so to speak.

I think he's really done a lot of research on it, and I'm intrigued, but also kinda hesitant, since I can barely eat chicken breasts without some kind of fat added to them.

Ellen
http://www.healthy-eating-politics.com
http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 03:54 PM


Expert Low-Carber



In the past, the PSMF was based on protein shakes from companies like medifast, and optifast, which were dangerous because the protein in the shakes was just collagen which can't be used by the body very well. Lyle McDonald has a different take. He recommends a whole foods protein fast for rapid weight loss.

Basically what he describes is a low calorie diet (based on your particular body needs) in which you eat mostly lean protein foods like chicken and fish, a tiny bit of carb and fat, and you take lots of fish oil for essential fatty acids and vitamins and minerals. You do this for as long as can stand it, or until you lose the weight you want to lose. He recommends that you "break" the diet every 4-6 weeks and replenish your glycogen stores, and he also allows for a few "free meals" each week as a psychological steam valve, so to speak.

I think he's really done a lot of research on it, and I'm intrigued, but also kinda hesitant, since I can barely eat chicken breasts without some kind of fat added to them.
I don't mean to dig up old dirt, but this kinda' reminds me of Kimkins. It might be worth trying, but not for very long. Atkins recommends a fat fast. Dr. Bernstein recommends cutting back on protein rather than fat if you are not losing weight. I beleive in "whatever works for you," so experiment if you will and see how it works.

Sugar is the enemy; fat is my friend. The only bad fats are artificial fats.
Low Fat & Fat Free -- tastes bad, bad for you.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 04:45 PM


Senior Low-Carber



In the past, the PSMF was based on protein shakes from companies like medifast, and optifast, which were dangerous because the protein in the shakes was just collagen which can't be used by the body very well. Lyle McDonald has a different take. He recommends a whole foods protein fast for rapid weight loss.

Basically what he describes is a low calorie diet (based on your particular body needs) in which you eat mostly lean protein foods like chicken and fish, a tiny bit of carb and fat, and you take lots of fish oil for essential fatty acids and vitamins and minerals. You do this for as long as can stand it, or until you lose the weight you want to lose. He recommends that you "break" the diet every 4-6 weeks and replenish your glycogen stores, and he also allows for a few "free meals" each week as a psychological steam valve, so to speak.

I think he's really done a lot of research on it, and I'm intrigued, but also kinda hesitant, since I can barely eat chicken breasts without some kind of fat added to them.
I don't mean to dig up old dirt, but this kinda' reminds me of Kimkins. It might be worth trying, but not for very long. Atkins recommends a fat fast. Dr. Bernstein recommends cutting back on protein rather than fat if you are not losing weight. I beleive in "whatever works for you," so experiment if you will and see how it works.
The body has a huge store of fat to burn for fuel so when you cut out fat completley your body will STRIP off the bodyfat.You take in a good amount more protein than you are now to prevent any muscle loss.....this fact I dont agree on though as Ive tried it with optimal levels(75gms)and the rest fat and didnt experience massive muscle loss.You take in I think 5gms fish oil and a quality multi vitaim/mineral.

Its hard though....its nicknamed Draconic diet for a reason.ANd you WILL rebound if you dont slowly add back in calories.This is where I feel Lyle errs in judgement.He says you can go back to a normal diet....I feel that this leads to binge eating and asked him about staying LC to counter this.He went on to say that he doesnt feel staying in ketosis is a healthy thing to do. SHHHH,I think he says this to keep people buying his books.

I say its better to just slowly drop calories by reducing the fat added to foods.If your eating 2000 then drop to 1500.Its not forever since when you achieve weightloss you can up the calories back to where you were maintaing.

Ellynwo,ask Lyle about the bodys ability to lay down fat with low insulin levels.There are other hormones that will do this no Problem....I forget the one he replied.He says GCBC doesnt even mention the main one.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-06-2009 05:31 PM


Expert Low-Carber


I don't eat nuthin' lean.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 05-07-2009 12:14 AM


Expert Low-Carber




"Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test
first, the lesson afterwards."

Vernon Sanders Law


RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-13-2009 02:24 PM


Newbie Low-Carber



I've been reading about this over at Lyle McDonald's site, and am curious to find some real life experiences with this method. I'd ask over there, but that forum is not as friendly as ours.. they are kinda grumpy over there.
I just started a PSMF Tuesday. It has been prescribed by my primary care physician and it's a weight loss clinic. It's really all about changing bad habits and kind of going to food rehab ... must give up all food! It's not bad though. You know how on some (most) diets the first days are horrible? This is not the case. I'm not hungry at all, if anything, its kind of difficult to drink all 8 shakes a day. The only problem is the limited flavors of shakes, but aside from that it's totally doable and I'm looking forward to weighing in on Monday.

When I think of the health risks and how much healthier I'll be, it's totally worth it. It's really not a big sacrifice and if done correctly (with medical supervision) it could better you for the rest of your life!
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-13-2009 07:28 PM


Moderator


Thanks for sharing your experience, sweetchilof81. Welcome to the forum.

My sites:
Linda's Low Carb Menus & Recipes
In the Kitchen with Linda Blog
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-13-2009 09:27 PM


Senior Low-Carber


Lyle's target audience is body builders. These guys eat tons to put on muscle and fat while training then starve themselves eating nothing but protein to force ketosis to burn fat and get that 0% body fat physique. They're all pretty much narcissists.

kevin
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-13-2009 10:43 PM


Senior Low-Carber


Ellen,

They might be "kinda grumpy" over at that other site because they are only eating dry chicken breasts!

In all seriousness, if you give it a whirl, keep us posted!
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-14-2009 12:29 PM


Expert Low-Carber


It does make sense in a way. We know what carbs do - so avoid them. Then theoretically the less fat you eat the more you burn from your own body stores.

Problem is this - I tend to find, and I'm sure others will agree, I lose more weight when I eat more fat. Calories being equal - for instance calorie sources - 10% carbs, 50% fat, 40% protein produces less weight loss (for me) than - 10% carbs, 65% fat, 25% protein.

There must be a reason for this. And more fat seems to push you into ketosis faster than more protein too.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-14-2009 05:08 PM


Expert Low-Carber



Problem is this - I tend to find, and I'm sure others will agree, I lose more weight when I eat more fat. Calories being equal - for instance calorie sources - 10% carbs, 50% fat, 40% protein produces less weight loss (for me) than - 10% carbs, 65% fat, 25% protein.

There must be a reason for this. And more fat seems to push you into ketosis faster than more protein too.
Not only do I lose more weight, I feel better with a greasy gut. My waist is smaller and I ain't gassy. Fat will push you into ketosis faster because ketosis is the result of burned fat. This residue we call ketones is also protein sparing.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-23-2009 09:58 AM


Junior Low-Carber


Quote:It does make sense in a way. We know what carbs do - so avoid them. Then theoretically the less fat you eat the more you burn from your own body stores

So is there actually any DANGER from eating this way, in the short term, say a month to dive into bodyfat stores and ketosis. I really do need to get a real kicking as I have been at the same weight for almost a year at high fat, mod protein,minimal carb level (Groves). I can tell from my spare tyre that there is still more to come off. I've been kidding myself that I am 'eating for health' rather than weight loss but I really do need to lose another 20lbs of actual fat. I like to use whey protein shakes with egg yolk and double cream to make egg cremes and could happily have these often.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-23-2009 11:51 AM


Unregistered

 
Quote:So is there actually any DANGER from eating this way, in the short term, say a month to dive into bodyfat stores and ketosis. I really do need to get a real kicking as I have been at the same weight for almost a year at high fat, mod protein,minimal carb level (Groves). I can tell from my spare tyre that there is still more to come off. I've been kidding myself that I am 'eating for health' rather than weight loss but I really do need to lose another 20lbs of actual fat. I like to use whey protein shakes with egg yolk and double cream to make egg cremes and could happily have these often.

Have you considered intermittent fasting (IF?). I was basically stuck for almost a year until I discovered this gem. It's a WOE I can see doing for the long haul (although to be honest I'll probably relax it a bit when I reach goal) that can be transitioned out of if needed. I think a PSMF is a bigger lifestyle change and the maintenance is difficult -- you would probably want to overshoot your goal by several pounds so you don't sweat some modest rebound. But so long as you're getting protein and vitamins/minerals and some of the EFA's it should be as safe as anything else over the short term. I was considering something like this myself to break my stall. If IF stops working I'll revisit this option as well.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 08-23-2009 01:32 PM


Junior Low-Carber


Thanks for that, I haven't considered IF, it might be worth a look.
RE: Protein Sparing Modified Fast , 09-27-2009 04:27 PM


Newbie Low-Carber


I've done a PSMF as defined by the Cleveland Clinic. The first time was in 2003. I lost 106 lbs. My starting weight was 310 lbs and I got down to 204. Unfortunately, I got back up to 288 by August 2005 because I didn't change my eating habits. I did another PSMF in 2007 and lost 47 lbs. Again, I didn't learn my lesson on controlling my food intake later and by June of 2009 I was back up to 314 lbs. I started my third PSMF on August 19th, 2009 with a starting weight of 288.4 and after completing 35 days I weighed in at 264.8 for a total loss of 23.6 pounds in 35 days. I explain in detail what exactly I've been doing here: http://psmf4u.blogspot.com/2009/08/psmf-details.html

I will tell you, as you may already know, being in Large Ketosis is a great appetite suppressant.

Good Luck!