IF ( Intermittent Fasting )
IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 04:23 PM


Moderator


There has been some talk of IF before and some that have followed IF for quite a while . I thought a thread of it's own would be in order so that it would bring it into the light and any wanting to learn about or try it could benefit by others experiences .

I for one , have not tried it in earnest and am going to give it another shot .
If you have done this before - please post and let us know how you are doing with it .

Here is some info Ron posted ( from another forum) in another thread that will give you some insight .

I'm going to start tomorrow - anyone else willing to give it a go with me ??

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 04:28 PM


Moderator


Patti, there are mornings (like today) when I'm not hungry and I skip breakfast. I consider these IF days. I normally quit eating at 6pm and on IF days don't eat until 10:30AM. That gives my digestive system a rest for over 16 hours.

Grace and peace,

moonius



Perseverance + patience = progress

http://moonius.blogspot.com/
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 06:13 PM


Moderator


Hey Jay - I did do a few weeks of IF as you might remember - but for some reason did not go back to it . I think sometimes , I do not eat enough and then in the mornings , I find that I am hungry . I'll play around with the times again , leaving an eating window , I think for now in the late afternoon early evening - maybe a 12-1 , 5:30-6pm eating time slots, eating a 1st meal and then a dinner meal the later time . Will see how the hunger goes and if it is conducive to losing for me .

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 06:39 PM


Moderator


Here's a couple more links of interest.

The IF Life

Eat STOP Eat

Dr. Eades' -- Fast Way to Better Health

Ron aka "The Former Donut Junkie"



My Life Without Donuts Blog
My FaceBook Page
The Just This One Taste rationalization is the Kiss of Death to the success of your journey to healthy living! ~~Dr. Atkins
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 11:32 PM


Moderator


black57 wrote :

Now upon reading my links, I want you all to know that there is additional information. When I decided to do IF, I knew that I had to "grow" into IF. I have read where someone would announce that they were going to begin IF "tomorrow". How can you begin tomorrow if you have never done it before? Your body will protest your attempt and it ain't pretty. I knew that it would not be easy at first so I worked my self into IF, gradually.I normally ate breakfast at 6:00 AM. So, for a few days, I began eating between 7 and 8 AM as my schedule allowed. I just ate breakfast later and later until I was able to go to 2:00 PM before breaking my fast. Once I was able to comfortably do that, then I considered myself and IFer. Once it is time to eat, I eat until I am good and full.

One thing that I have theorized is that the body needs time, real time, to completely digest it contents. If you consume a meal before this process is over, your body must put stuff into storage in order to begin its next task. Digestion includes the stomach, intestines,liver, pancreas. I know that there are more organs that contribute to the process. So what if you gave each organ 5 hours to process...the minnimum length of time would be 20 hours. The only reason I point that out is to simplify the length of time that goes into fasting. All that said, I can attest to the fact that I have to "go" within 1 hour after eating my break fasting meal. You can set your watch to my BMs:rolleyes:TMI,I know but it is necessary to post that information.

In addition, IF promotes ketosis. Ketosis exists to supports the body's organs, muscles etc during famine. Ketosis is the starvation mode. The starvation mode isn't the phenomenon that we heard about when we began our diets.The starvation mode is, indeed, ketosis. Back in the day our ancestors did not have McDonalds, grocery stores, refrigerators, freezers. microwave ovens, KFC or diet plans. They ate as much food that they could at a setting and then did not eat again for many, many hours or even several days before hunting for their next meal. Yes, they hunted on an empty stomach. This resulted in the increased output of human growth hormone. This could not be done without insulin being stable, so we know that ketosis kept that insulin stable. I remember learning in history class that the colonists considered the natives as being lazy since they rarely ate, especially in the winter months. They thought the natives were too lazy to get food. I didn't think much of it at the time ( I was just beginning Atkins then ). But now it is clear. Ketosis brought on by their naturally low carb diet and fasting was met by decreased appetite. I wish that I knew then, what I know now.

Now that you have an idea of what I do...Here is the actual breakdown.
first meal is at 2:00 and a 4 hour eating window follows. I eat as much food as I want during this window. So at 6:00 my window closes until the next day. It may seem long but once you can do this you will discover that it is normal. Now the best way to do this is to have one meal one day and and the next day have 2 meals, but I can't do that on a regular basis. I have done it on occasion though. After adding this to my low carb diet for 1 1/2 years, I have lost 26 lbs. I function just fine on fewer meals and residual aches and pains have vanished completely. Something like this cannot be met with speculation...you must go ahead and try it. Do your own experiement and don't just jump in it...prepare. Ron, I liked the link you posted. One thing that I can say about IF, it is impossible to binge. However, it is okay to eat a ton of food one day 'cuz you won't do it the next. There are days when I hardly ever eat and others when I eat like crazy. Both days balance out hunger. Also once you are truly an IFer, you don't mind waiting a few extra hours to eat. I IF like a cavewoman. In other words, if I am offered something before the fasting is over, I just might eat. My cave sistah would have eaten a berrie or two if she came upon it before her mate came home with dinner. She did not think about her waistline in the least and guess what? Her waistline did not suffer for it. So it is okay to change the feeding process from now and again. It is no big deal but don't do it often. To understand this, you must be an habitual IFer.

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 11:35 PM


Moderator


Mary this is some great info - thanks .

I had been eating to hunger - I was at 2 meals a day and then I think I tried eating too little - became too hungry and started eating more x's instead of increasing - or eating to full . That's where I think I went off .

I have been very disciplined and know that I can again return to IF.
I agree that it is something you have to research and "grow" into with planning .
's

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 11:49 PM


Moderator


Black57 wrote:

PatTee, the reason it was easy and enjoyable for me was that I could pig out. Simply put, eat like a pig, Feast. Your appetite will balance out with each meal so on your next low carb meal, you just may want absolutely nothin' <<<Burp>>>. My daughter was visiting from out of town and was a little worried about days where I had absolutely no appetite and barely ate anything. If I am "starving", I eat like I am starving. If I am not hungry, it is impossible to eat. Either way, I have not felt ill, stuffed,or embalanced. As I said before, I am more regular than I have ever been.

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-08-2008 11:52 PM


Moderator


I liked the fact that you can actually feel real hunger - know it , experience it and then eat . It has taken me a lot of years to actually know this !!
I still experience some "head " hunger as yet , but now at least I know the difference !

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-09-2008 12:25 AM


Moderator


black57 Wrote:When I decided to do IF, I knew that I had to "grow" into IF. I have read where someone would announce that they were going to begin IF "tomorrow". How can you begin tomorrow if you have never done it before? Your body will protest your attempt and it ain't pretty. I knew that it would not be easy at first so I worked my self into IF, gradually.I normally ate breakfast at 6:00 AM. So, for a few days, I began eating between 7 and 8 AM as my schedule allowed. I just ate breakfast later and later until I was able to go to 2:00 PM before breaking my fast. Once I was able to comfortably do that, then I considered myself and IFer. Once it is time to eat, I eat until I am good and full.

Mary, this is a valuable piece of information on the "work your way into IF". I've done religious food fasts with time periods of one to ten days, abstaining from food and drinking only juice and water. And it's not easy, especially when you do hard work such as I do in my business. But I really like the idea of the IF approach and especially being able to continually push the breakfast time farther ahead. Thanks so much for being so willing to share your thoughts and experiences on this most fascinating subject.

Ron aka "The Former Donut Junkie"



My Life Without Donuts Blog
My FaceBook Page
The Just This One Taste rationalization is the Kiss of Death to the success of your journey to healthy living! ~~Dr. Atkins
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-09-2008 02:22 AM


Expert Low-Carber


Ron, You just don't know. I want to express this to everyone especially my own family. They already think that I am that crazy LC woman. I recall my sister having the look of disbelief on her face when I told her how I eat.


Okay, the procedure was a breeze and I had no need to pass gas. Also, I had no desire to stop at a restaurant. I went home and fixed a hearty meal. This was actually my longest fast because I started it sooner than what I was supposed to. I was thinking of another things that would benefit from IF...that would be a disaster. For example, as you all know, here in CA we usually expect an earthquake or a fire. Being able to forgoe eating for a long period of time can be quite beneficial.

Keeping that in mind, I find that my body responds to exercise/physical activity better when I am fasting.Yes, it is possible to experience hunger and not even think about eating.It also makes you more aware of body functions for example stomach growling. I discovered that the growling sound that the tummy makes is actually peristalsis, that is, the digestive process, not an empty tummy. However it happens towards the end of digestion it isn't a call to eat.

Ugh, I keep thinking of things to add. Upon turning fifty, I purchased a book titled "Fifty Things To Do When You Turn Fifty". One of the things listed was to realize that you do not need to eat as often. As a matter of fact you may find that one or 2 meals a day is enough. So, I definitely think that the older we get the more we need to IF.
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-09-2008 01:29 PM


Moderator


Morning all .
Well , I weighed this morning and I am at my listed current weight . Which to me means that the gains during Thanksgiving were mostly water .
This morning I am starting my IF . Will see when my hunger calls out for a meal today . I have my food available so it's a no brainer as to what to eat.
This morning I'm having my coffee - I don't think there's anything that will ever change that !!LOL! I'm not at all hungry as yet - , I'm never really this early and have found in the past that hunger usually sets in after noon sometime .


Mary , you have some great knowledge on this !! I totally agree with as you get older the less food you need. The bod's slow down , so should the fuel !!

In the animal world , it's the same - max cals. and food for puppies and kitties , as they mature the quantities/cals are supposed to decrease also !

I also think that one's family members have gotten sooo very used to us eating a lot and often that any change as "radical" (LOL) a change as this LC is and they start to freak ! Our DS, DDIL and DD , have been talking amongst themselves expressing concern for me . I think , they think , I've totally lost it !!! Unfortunately the info about LC has not been out there en masse and they think it is radical !! They understand fully about the sugar , but breads and grains and potatoes - that's another story .
It's gonna take some time - all around.

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-09-2008 07:12 PM


Expert Low-Carber


Hey Patti. I'm so glad you started this thread. IF is not something I had thought about before reading here, and then also reading some of the reference links yesterday. However, now I'm REALLY interested in this as it so suits my lifestyle. I find it a real chore to eat early in the day, in fact much before noon at the earliest. I would be quite comfortable starting out with an IF window of eating from say 2:00 PM to 8:00 PM then gradually decrease it to ideally 4:00 or 5:00 PM to 8:00 PM. This would free me up from having to worry about food in any way for most of the day. No more packing lunches and fitting in eating when I don't really care whether I eat or not. I think this WOE would be very liberating and am excited to get started. I will definitely do more reading up on it and also take into consideration Mary's warning about easing into it so as not to "terrorize" my digestive system - LOL! Thanks again Patti, Ron, Mary and everyone else who has contributed information and experiences to this great thread!!!! XO Trish

Trish in British Columbia, Canada
"Lord, please keep Your arm around my shoulder and Your hand over my mouth!"
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-09-2008 07:23 PM


Administrator


I couldn't do it, but I'm glad IF works for others. Here's my experience:

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/?p=1912

Jimmy Moore, "Livin' La Vida Low-Carb Discussion" forum owner
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RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 02:21 AM


Expert Low-Carber


As I read through the posts, I don't fet the feeling that everyone understands IF as I do. For one IF IS ketogenic and works quite well with LC. They reinforce each other. You eat more on IF and you eat less on IF. There are days when I am crazy insane hungry and when it is time to break my fast, I eat like I am crazy insane hungry. I don't restrict my eating at all. I fill up and then I do not feel like eating for the remainder of the day.Other times, as I said in an earlier post, I don't feel like eating at all. Even though I said that I do not eat in the morning...sometimes I do eat an early morning breakfast. When I do, I do not eat supper until later on in the evening. Either way, I fast in a way that works for me. Fasting should be personalized, not standard. IMHO, intermittent fasting can mean 3 meals a day especially if you are accustomed to eating 4-6 times a day, as I was. When you begin IF, you have to do it with the acceptance that we all fast. It is impossible to eat breakfast without fasting. So if you have your last meal at 5:00 at night and then do not eat the next day until 7:00 or 8:00 A.M. You have fasted for 14 hours, if I did my math right. Does that sound difficult? Especially if you've consumed a large low carb meal. If you have a steak with a sliced avocado/shrimp salad and some buttered mashed turnips. Wash that down with a V8 and low carb cheese cake or strawberries and sour cream. Stir some whey protein into the sour cream> that will, indeed, stick with you until 7:00 the next morning. It may even last until 9:00. Also add mct or coconut oil and heavy cream to your morning coffee, you just may not want to eat until 10:00 or noon. So it depends on what you eat when you fast. If you plan on fasting, don't do it without a good hearty, filling low carb meal. Do not be afraid to eat a lot of food, if you want it. I am beginning to believe that losing weight has nothing to do with how little or how much we eat but with reducing the meal frequencies.I take that back, weightloss relies on eating well but less frequently. Stay very low carb and don't be afraid to eat, eat, eat. I increased my fats by implementing more butter, real cream, coconut oil,mct, Krill oil.

Well, you might ask, how can you fast and take in calories. Well, if calories do not count when you are eating lc, then they definitely do not count when you are fasting...so add some extra fats to your fast. I take my supplements in the AM when I am fasting...after drinking my morning coffee with cream and coconut oil. Don't do this scientifically, do it realistically. If you fast scientifically, you will fail. Fasting existed long before "science". People who relied on fasting for their very survival consumed a high amount of fats without looking at the clock. They ate when they had food, not when their watch said it is time to eat. They gorged on food because the had no idea when their next meal would be. This is how I fast. If miss cavewomen was ressurected and had to meld her lifestyle into the lifestyle of modern man/woman, how would she do it? She would look for the fattiest cuts of meat, cream, ghee, butter, coconut oil, chocolate ( any woman's dream low carb treat ), nut butters,nuts,avocadoes,cheeses. All of these things would be highest on her shopping list and highly ketogenic: a word she knew nothing about but knew that these foods would stick to her ribs for days....Then she would choose berries, pumpkin, vegetables. She would also eat a relatively enormous amount of food because she had no idea when her next meal would be. Afterall, she has experienced going days without eating, not by choice. So the idea is to not only eat well, but eat in a way that would control your desire to eat. Imagine hot cocoa made with cream, water, cocoa and splenda. Umm, how delicious and great during the winter months.My favorite meal is collards baked in a large casserole dish with texas pork ribs, bacon, crushed pepper flakes, chicken broth and butter. This is good eatin', y'all and did not pop into my head until I began fasting. I craved this. Although I have eaten this, I never had it all baked in a dutch oven. But, it was perfect for my day. My kids loved it. I had guests for a few days this summer. I served this to them and they loved it. How about chicken thighs stuffed with brie and blueberries. Never did these unusual food ideas cross my mind until I began IFing. But whatever my body cries out for, I feed it. If I were craving chocolate ice cream, that is what I would eat...as long as I entered my fasting window.

Either way, the reason I am sucessful with IF is that I do it in a way that works for me. That being said, I never begin a fast without a big healthy low carb meal. If I am having a day where my appetite small, I eat in accordance even though my fast is about to start. Ugh, I am getting sleepy and beginning to ramble but I hope that I have been helpful.
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 09:41 AM


Moderator


Mary, excellent advice. I love the way you're teaching us the back-to-basics and historical way of fasting...the primal way! I totally agree that it has to be realistic and not scientific in order to make it work...and work as a lifestyle.

One thing you mentioned that some may not be aware of is that one can drink their coffee or tea with HWC or coconut oil in the mornings. I love coconut oil with my coffee anytime of the day and it is especially energizing in the mornings.

Again, you've done an excellent job of trying to get us to 'do what works for us' with IF and not necessarily what someone wrote in a textbook. I can see where it will take some time to 'play' and experiment with IF until we become comfortable with it. Thanks so much for taking the time to share your experience with the rest of us. We really do appreciate you!

Ron aka "The Former Donut Junkie"



My Life Without Donuts Blog
My FaceBook Page
The Just This One Taste rationalization is the Kiss of Death to the success of your journey to healthy living! ~~Dr. Atkins
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 11:26 AM


Moderator


Mary , I think that this is such a healthy and intuned way of life !! So many of us eat for no reason and all the wrong reasons - all wrapped up into one confusing mess.
Learning to listen to your body and what it needs - when it needs it .
What a concept !!! It's what I strive for and am on my way after years of practically force feeding my body .

Thanks Mary - please keep your experiences and help points coming !!!!

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 06:13 PM


Expert Low-Carber


What's funny is that up to 1 1/2 years ago, I though fasting was the most unhealthy thing anyone can do their bodies. Everything changes with time. obviously. Coincidentally, there was a comment on IF in my email, from Dr. Eades blog. I think when you read it you will see how IF must be individualized. Scroll down to almost the end where there is a comment from S. Reed, it is dated Dec. 4:
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/inter...uest-blog/

Ron, let's say that again, add some Coconut oil and cream to your coffee.I find that I have a lot of energy without that stupid insulin spike. It is like my body is wide awake and it is something that is going to stick with me.

PatTee, along with what you said, I feel that I discovered food once I began IF. When I think that I will be eating a steak and a salad of sliced avocado, tomato and onion, I really look forward to breaking my fast. I do not feel that pull of hunger that insists that I cannot wait another 2 hours before eating. Waiting also makes food more enjoyable. I plan on eating a lot but I am betting that my appetite may stop before I finish eating.. If not, I look forward to a dessert of fresh strawberries, sour cream ( sweetened with whey protein powder ). And to think, I can eat as much as a want without measuring portion sizes.

I have more to say but will write more after I take my son to work.

Mary
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 07:14 PM


Moderator


Coconut Oil and Heavy Whipping Cream it is Mary! I'm picking up the HWC hopefully tomorrow.

Ron aka "The Former Donut Junkie"



My Life Without Donuts Blog
My FaceBook Page
The Just This One Taste rationalization is the Kiss of Death to the success of your journey to healthy living! ~~Dr. Atkins
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 07:19 PM


Moderator


It's great Ron !! Although , I still love black coffee , it's good for a change .

One minute, one hour, one day, 1 pound at a time ...



BEFORE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DURING>>>>>>>>>

commitment = success

Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying .... "I will try again tomorrow". ~ Mary Anne Radmacher
RE: IF ( Intermittent Fasting ) , 12-10-2008 07:29 PM


Expert Low-Carber


My favorite heavy whipping cream is at Trader Joes. It is very thick and whips up quickly if you would like to make whipped cream with it. Mainly the oil soothes a growling tummy and keeps hunger at bay without ruining your appetite, unless you use too much. I take my fat soluble supplements with it.

Once I had a headache that I blamed my fast for causing, but remembered reading that headaches can be caused by low magnesium. So I took a magnesium tablet with my coffee and cream and the headache vanished. As a matter of fact, I am finding that magnesium works as well as tylenol on my headaches. However, I rarely get headaches since I take magnesium anyway.

Remember to ease into IF don't jump into it. I want to see you guys stick with it!!!